Experiences with Sensura Mio Convex Flip for high-output ostomates?

Hi guys,

Looking to hear from my high output buddies who are using the Colo Sensura Mio Convex Flip 2-piece..........or 1 piece, as the bag is the same size. I just started using the samples they sent me the other day in a quest to try something other than the Hollister stuff I've been using since getting my front-butt 7 years ago. As I've posted, I've been dealing with skin irritation under and around my barrier, and have eliminated all causes except the Hollister barrier material. So now I'm trying the Mio Convex, the star-shaped plastic barrier. My first attempt ended in failure as I failed to notice the tangs for the belt are on the barrier, not on the bag like Hollister, so the barrier orientation has to be correct or you can't wear the belt. I didn't notice that and after I stuck my barrier on, I realized the belt tangs were perfectly vertical, not horizontal. Not wanting to wear the belt as a suspender, I had to rip that one off and wait for another day. Which was yesterday. This time I paid attention and got it stuck on just right........with the tangs horizontal.

Then I put the bag on............and rolled up the end like 4 times to close it with those stupid little Velcro arms. The closure system leaves a lot to be desired for a high output person, but I guess for someone who only empties a couple of times a day it's fine. But the real problem is the bag is so small!! It holds like half of what my Hollister bag held. I mean it's a pretty chic system, the bag feels nice, has a vent, and can completely roll up out of the way for wearing your shirt outside your pants...........but it doesn't hold much? Which for a high outputer means my previous frequent bag emptyings now just increased even more! I mean who designed this thing? On the plus side, it will force me to eat smaller portions and drink less, but now I have to check this thing constantly, and emptying is way more of a mess than the simple Hollister clip method. I mean if I fall asleep after eating, I'm waking up to a friggin' mess, no doubt about it.

I checked the Colo catalog and will call the osto-assistant tomorrow, but don't see any larger bags. I mean this is a showstopper for me, and with my luck, my skin will love the barrier material, but I'll be stuck spending my waking hours emptying this stupid thing. So I'm curious what the other high output folks are doing about this, if anything. With their bag attachment clamp system, I can't retrofit anything to it, but I'm trying. If someone built a better mousetrap, please let me know. Otherwise, I'll just keep standing here banging my head against the wall. UGH!

;0)

Bob

Hi Bob

I don't have the issues you speak of, but I have some color samples to try out one day.

But I just can't go there because of the closure system, it's a shocker compared to the fastener on what I use now.

Bag looks good, just let down by the two tiny Velcro tags.

Hey Bob! I was set up with Hollister right after surgery. The bag was too big and leaked all the time. I switched to Coloplast Sensura Mio 11474. I have fairly high output and the Velcro bottom works like a charm. I was hesitant at first but no issues. I really like the two-piece as it has a lock clip to secure the bag to the flange. Maybe give it a try! Good luck.

Hey Bob! I was set up with Hollister right after surgery. The bag was too big and leaked all the time. I switched to Coloplast Sensura Mio 11474. I have fairly high output and the Velcro bottom works like a charm. I was hesitant at first but no issues. I really like the two-piece as it has a lock clip to secure the bag to the flange. Maybe give it a try! Good luck.

Hi Bob,

I am not sure what you consider high output, but I have been using Coloplast since day one, which was about 9 years ago, not counting my first ostomy in 2004.

I love the Velcro closure. When those crazy clips would land on the floor of some public restroom, I did not want to use it again, now no worries.

I also actually looked for the shortest pouch I could find. When having leak issues and itching under barrier, I did everything to stay with Coloplast instead of other companies. I empty about 10-12 times a day because I don't like the feeling of too much in the pouch.

I have used the winged barrier you are referring to, but go back to the regular convex oval-shaped barrier.

Hope this helps.

Elaine

Stories of Living Life to the Fullest from Ostomy Advocates I Hollister

Hey Bob... I tried Sen Convex Flip also several weeks ago. One had a filter... I called them and they sent different ones as the filter ring inside gets clogged with my high output. The next had no ring filter, but also was too small and every hour I was dumping. Then they sent me a larger bag with no filter... yippie, until I opened it and it had a hard plug at the bottom and I hated it with fear it would open. So, I have to stick with my Hollister until they make a new one... I was told they are working on it, yeah... right? I hope so because I love the nice gray silky bag.
Let me know if you find a different solution for us high output folks.

Ritz

If your skin does not like Hollister's adhesive, but you prefer that pouch style, could you try using the Coloplast Brava sheets in between as a buffer?

Or, Coloplast makes high output pouches with a "spigot" type end...you could snip off the spigot and use a clamp instead. I do that with my high output patients who prefer a clamp or who have output that is just a bit too thick for the spigot.

Hi Axl,

I hear you, bro... it is a stupid closure system. Not to mention messy. I was even looking to see if I could snip off the end and use my Hollister clip instead, but you can't. I was talking to Colo today and they do make a larger bag, but it has an even nuttier closure system. It's really a urostomy bag with a slightly larger funnel on the end. But there may be room to clip the funnel off and use my Hollister clip. We'll see when they get here.

Now, to be fair, the whole Colo system is a bit more 'high class' than the Hollister stuff. The bag feels chic and just of higher quality all around. I have the opaque bags, which have a filter (that I don't need), but also a viewing port to see what's going on, if need be, and you can fold the bag completely up if you don't have a lot of output. Overall, I'd say it's a nice system, just not for what ails me.

One thing to note is that unlike the Hollister system, where the mounting tabs for the belt are on the bag... on the Colo, they're on the barrier. So you can't just slap the barrier on in any orientation... like I mistakenly did on my first try. I was thinking I was all done, put the bag on... and then tried to put the belt on. Except I stuck the bag on me with the belt tabs in a vertical position, not horizontal. Sample #1 right down the drain. Note to self... don't do that again! I've also found their rings are very different from Hollister's. The Colo rings expand when they come in contact with output... whereas the Hollisters don't. That luckily turned out to be a good thing for my scenario, but others should know about that.

On the positive side... wearing a much smaller bag is making me pay more attention to how much I eat and drink, and when. Something I planned to do down the road, so it just nudged my schedule up a bit. It's always something...

;0)

Bob

Hi Gemini,

As I was telling Axl, the Mio is a nice system, just not as convenient for my situation. With the bigger Hollister bag, I was emptying it maybe 15 to 20 times a day. Now with the smaller Mio bag, I've had to up that number significantly. When you empty it that many times a day, those little Velcro tabs become a pain in the ass to deal with. With the Hollister clip, I could simply pop it off, do the two-finger squeegee thing to the bag, and re-clip.......and be done literally 5 seconds. The Mio is more complicated. And by the time you roll up the end 4 times, you've lost a good portion of the bag volume. It's nice that the bag sits higher from a fashion standpoint, but at this point, I've got a full wardrobe of long shirts......so that feature doesn't gain me much.

The purpose of my trying the Mio is to address some skin irritation issues under my barrier. If the Mio helps in that regard, I'll shut up and deal with the small bag.......although I do have the larger urostomy-style bags on the way. Part of my bitching is that I've used the Hollister system so long it's ingrained in my thinking. Anything else that's different registers as 'wrong' until I get used to it. Which is what I'm doing now with the Mio.

One weird thing about the Mio.........I'm using the Convex Flip with the 5 'fingers' around the periphery.......the barrier itself is a semi-flexible plastic, where the Hollister is a cloth bandage. The Mio does a great job of gripping a domed surface around the stoma, but my bulge isn't that pronounced. But it IS when I remove the Mio.....because the Mio, by way of its shape, actually creates the size bulge it needs to fit properly. So I did a double-take when I removed it for the first time after wearing it for 3 days..........as I had a much larger and pronounced bulge........until my skin slowly went back to its flatter shape. But I tried the non-convex Mio and that needs a very flat surface, or it doesn't work. So it's like Goldilocks......the convex flip is too much, the regular Mio is too little........and there's nothing in the middle. But the flip is working so far............so I'll keep my fingers crossed!!!

;0)

Bob

Hi Elaine,

I hear you, I've accidentally flushed a clip down the toilet once.........so having a closure system that can't fall off is a nice-to-have. I'm with you on staying with what you have.......but at this point I've addressed all the other possible dermatological causes that could be affecting my skin and changing barrier material is my last solution to try. When I pulled the Mio off this morning after wearing it 3 days..........I only get 2 days max out of the Hollister........parts of my peristomal skin didn't look all that happy......but one try does not eliminate a possible solution. Talking to Coloplast today they told me to give my skin at least 3 barrier changes to see if it calms down.......so I'll do that. It's also another data point to give to my dermatologist for her to ponder. As I told the Axe-man above......I do like the Coloplast rings. I ordered a few different sizes today, and if I have to go back to Hollister barriers I'm going to see if the Coloplast rings are compatible.

I actually cut off the ends of the 5 fingers of the convex Mio, as they really don't serve a purpose and I want to limit contact with my skin as much as possible. When I tried the non-convex flip style you're using I found the skin around my stoma was a bit too domed for it to work, and since it can't stretch like the Hollister bandage it just didn't stick well to my shape. But if it's working for you that's awesome!!! And it is neat the way you can fold the bag up almost all the way with that little Velcro tab in the middle of the bag........very smart idea. You can tell some thinking went into the Coloplast Sensura Mio products. Thanks for your reply!!

;0)

Bob

Hey Ritzer,

Yes, ma'am to all that! I was looking at the filter and its internal ring this morning after I removed my barrier. And I was surprised at how full that inner filter ring was. Alarmingly so. I don't need a filter, but figured it wouldn't do any harm.........but had I tried to get another day out of it........there may have been an issue. Bingo on the extra emptying..........a real pain in the arse. I find myself constantly checking my bag level with my right hand all day long, so as not to overfill it. And yeah, I did see the bigger bags I ordered had that silly hard funnel at the bottom. I asked the gal if they were really for ileos and not urostomies......and she assured me they were. But when I asked her what happens if I don't chew well and a big chunk of something can't fit through the funnel.........then what do I do? She didn't have a good answer. I'm hoping when it gets here that at least the funnel hole will be BIG. If not, it might be a non-starter. Unless.......I can clip off the hard funnel and use my Hollister clip. I'm hoping that's the case, as I can just imagine what happens if I bump my partially full bag on something..........and the little funnel tip pops out!!!

Yeah, the bag material is pretty sweet.........better than the Hollister stuff. Just seems like higher quality overall.....but then again, it's under my shirt all day.....no one will ever see it. But I do like the little flap you can lift up to see what's going on inside. Didn't think I'd use it, but I do like to check on things every now and then. Another good idea!! Roger that.........I'll let you know if I find a better mousetrap!!!

Thanks,

Bob

Hi MBT,

As Gordon Lightfoot so eloquently wrote....."If you could read my mind girl, what a tale my heart would tell". I'm right there with ya on the "clip that damn funnel off and Holister clip that bitch to death!!" thing! I'm walking around right now with my little curved scissors in my pocket........just waiting for the idiot Amazon driver to drive by my place a few times until I go out there and stand in front of one of my three BIG house number signs and flag him down. Then Joe Idiot will stop and ask me if the house behind me is 45882....with the house number sign right in plain view. I'll say "yup, this is the place", and then he'll say "I had a hard time finding it". At which point I usually point to all THREE places where my house numbers are displayed in BIG REFLECTIVE NUMBERS......and he'll then give me that deer-in-the-headlights look and hop back in his truck. But lately I've just said "yup" and shake my head and walk away. Cuz as Forrest Gump said........"you can't fix stupid". Why anyone would pay those idiots $15 an hour is so beyond my level of comprehension; I don't waste time thinking about it.

On the other hand, if I keep the funnel spigot I guess I could draw with my output..........like they write on a birthday cake. Just grab the bag above the funnel and squeeze! I can spell BOB in shit! I bet the little girls across the street will be amazed by that!!! As long as no one thinks it's chocolate..........................

;0)

Bob

Is Colo the same as Coloplast? I have ileostomy with high output. I tried this one but unfortunately used the one with no convexity and had problems within a few hours. I like the material of this one the best; but I have been trying to sample all of them including Hollister and Convatec too. Compared to my old system from 50 years ago (Marlen brand) vinyl pouch, the others don't measure up.

I think part of the problem is the tail opening. Marlen's pouch opening is approximately 1" wide and all of the others seem to be about 2" wide. Much easier to handle emptying. Plus, the material on all of them doesn't withstand handling compared to the Marlen. I think they are all very flimsy and very messy to use.

However, I think all of them are much easier to apply and remove. But, I think I am going back to Marlen. Too bad they can't make one of these other pouches in the same material as the Marlen pouch in the vinyl or plastic material.

Hi Redondo,

Yes, Colo=Coloplast. I work for the military, so everything we say is either an abbreviation or an acronym......sorry about that. I had the same experience with the Colo Mio with no convexity. I'm surprised anyone likes the Coloplast material the best........just because it's so much more rigid than the cloth bandage of the Hollister. I have no experience with Marlen products, but was led to believe (from reading posts on here) that they were sort of archaic in nature.......I'm thinking hot water bottle thickness and material, as compared to the other vendor's products..........but it's just the impression I got, as I've never touched one in person.

I hear you when you say "flimsy", but in today's 'throw away' society's mentality people tend to like thinner, lighter, etc, rather than thicker, heavier and more durable. The messy part I can't comment on too much until I play with a Marlen bag, but I understand what you're saying. I'll have to look into Marlen and see what they're about. A word about sampling the various brands........I find the people at the ostomy product manufacturer's places try really hard to send you the right samples, but in my case they seldom actually do. I'm not sure why, maybe because they talk to people all day about sending samples and just get used to sending the same thing over and over..........but I described my condition, wants, needs and desires to the Coloplast guy twice......and he still sent me the wrong stuff. Had the same thing happen with Hollister a few years back. So now I just look through the catalogs myself and order what I think I want to try from either Amazon or one of the many online ostomy supply vendors. Most of the products you can order as singles, if you don't want to invest in a box of 5 or 10. I know many can't afford to do that, but for me it's money well spent.......as these days my time is more valuable than my money. But I'm glad you mentioned Marlen......I'm going to go check them out. Even if I don't like what they have, I like having situational awareness about these things. Thanks again!

Regards,

Bob

Hi M,

I missed responding to your first point, sorry about that. I've tried a number of membranes, liquid protectants, etc., but my skin just never healed under them. Probably because I change my barrier every other day and end up ripping off any new skin that forms under the membrane. I did have decent luck with Marathon, but if I could have left it on a few more days I think it would have helped. And I know you can leave it on and put a second barrier over it, but it takes 4-5 days for the Marathon to break down.......on day 2 it just breaks down on the edges, and when taking the barrier off (as gently as possible) it still brings some of the Marathon (and my skin) with it.

The only thing that's working so far are topical steroids, but they are making my skin in that area thin, which won't end well if I keep using them. It's feeling pretty itchy under my second Mio Convex Flip......and I change it tomorrow morning. I'm betting things won't look so good. But we'll see. The other issue I have with my Hollister barrier is I really need a larger barrier to properly fit my stoma. They don't make the convex Cera version in the really big size, so I'm having to improvise. Keep in mind I've been using Hollister since 2014 with only minor problems every now and then, but for the most part without trouble. My irritation problem started in early May of this year, for an unknown reason, so I'm not sure it's the Hollister material that's causing it. Switching to something else is just the only thing I haven't tried.

I did get the name of a high-profile dermatologist up in DC who supposedly specializes in contact dermatitis. I plan to see her, but wanted to try the Mio first, so she can't say....just try another product Dunderhead! I want to give her a REAL challenge!

;0)

Bob

Hi, I don't have high output but am lazy and prefer to have less trips to the bathroom.

I use Click High Output pouch. More than a foot long. Drawback: Teeny tiny sleeve output tube and an odd input system. But worth it! The only problem is if you pancake and normally don't rinse. It just will not come out easily. I certainly sleep a lot better!

SenSura Mio. 18612. Coloplast. 10 PCS per box

Note one of the guys was nervous about the hard plug at the bottom. I assure you it is very secure even when the bag is bloated.

Hi Fred,

Thanks for the input. My samples of the big bag came today. Holy shit, that thing is BIG!!! It sure doesn't look that big in the catalog! The opening at the bottom of the plastic funnel does seem a bit small for the size of the bag, but I checked and I can clip it off and use my Hollister clip instead. But I will say that using the small bag (with the bottom that rolls up 4 times and is held by the two Velcro wings) has made me focus a lot more on when and how much I eat, so as not to overfill it at the wrong time. I needed that kick in the ass to get my life a bit more normal in that regard. Can't eat a half gallon of ice cream anymore with the small bag... just a bowl or so. Not sure if I'm going to try the big bag or not... need to look at my schedule and find a section that's clear for 2 days, lest I be seen in public with a garbage bag of shit attached to me!! I guess I got what I asked for in a bigger bag... I just need to be a bit more careful about what I ask for!! Thanks again.

Regards,

Bob

Are you sure they didn't send you a urostomy bag in error? That would explain the hard plastic plug on the bottom.

Hi Kray,

No, it wasn't a mistake. They have the urostomy bags you're talking about, and the larger ostomy bags that they sent. I just got mine yesterday. They look identical, except the hard plastic funnel on the end is a bit larger for ostomy folks........but other than that they're the same. I decided not to wear it this morning when I changed my barrier, as it's just too big. I had to do a lot of tree climbing today and I could see that big bag getting caught on limbs and such...........so I stuck with the small one. I did take my old bag apart to better look at the filter system. There's a sponge or open cell foam mesh in the inner circular filter compartment with the filter at the top. I guess it would work for those with more solid output. My filter ring filled up in 2 days, but never leaked.

My initial take on the smaller bag was that it was too small, and I still think that........but I do see the benefit of the smaller bag in that it hides better under your clothes. I'm not a fan of the flip-up and Velcro closure system, but have gotten used to it. Unfortunately, my skin under the barrier isn't liking the Coloplast material any better than the Hollister, but I'm glad I tried it. I do have a hard time snapping the bag onto the barrier (2-piece) when I'm finishing up my barrier replacement......but it sure won't come off.

;0)

Bob

I know what you mean. I do not like the roll up Velcro seal. I think it's messy and very difficult to clean. Much prefer the curved clamp closure myself. However, if you have to purchase them they are expensive. I myself use a Convatec pouch because Hollister doesn't make a deep enough convex one-piece pouch, so I have to purchase the clamp from Hollister. $3.50 apiece. I sometimes get lucky and am able to pick some up at our support group meetings. People donate supplies from loved ones no longer needing them or that have passed away or been reversed.

Hi Kray,

Just shoot me a PM with your address and I'll send you a bunch of those Hollister clips. I play a game of seeing how long I can keep using the same couple clips over and over before they break.......so I've got a pile of new ones I'll never use. Don't pay for them.......I got plenty!! And they do last a very long time!!!

Regards,

Bob

My ostomy nurse had me measure my output in one of those "hats" you are given in the hospital to measure urine or fecal output. I was to record the output for 24 hours. I called her with the information and was told my output was too high. The nurse started me on loperamide 2 mg per day. It is also called Imodium and is over the counter. It has helped. I am using the Sensura Mio Convex Flip and I understand and feel what you feel - couldn't they make the pouch even a little bigger? But I am concerned that you feel the need to cut down what you eat and drink. I would not want you to get dehydrated. I also have to wear a Nu Hope belt (my ostomy nurse has sized me for it) which fits around the Mio skin barrier (between the barrier and pouch) and holds it in place. It is more secure than the Coloplast belts. I realized it made a difference in preventing leakages because when I bend at the waist, it affects the adherence of my pouch due to where my ileostomy is located. The Nu-Hope belt ring and belt keeps the pouch flat even when I bend at the waist! It's an extra bit of annoyance at times, but it has saved me the much bigger annoyance of not being able to keep my pouch on without leakages! I don't know if any of this will be of help, but don't give up until you find the solution that is right for you!

Hi everowell,

Your post brought a smile to my face..........I've been on Loperamide since I got short gutted. But 2mg per day is what made me smile. I started on 32mg/day.....4 tabs x 4 times per day.....so I wouldn't even notice 2mg! I've weaned back to 16mg per day and have been there for some time now. In addition, I also take Diphen-Atropine to slow my motility. Because I've got such a short amount of bowel remaining, I've found I just don't hydrate well while my intestine is full of food. Not enough parking spaces at the mall, I suppose......so I rehydrate in the wee hours of the morning when my bowels are empty.

I'm always asked how much output I have.........and I just look at them with a contemptuous grin and say......it depends on how much I eat and drink! So don't you need to know what I put in to know if what I get out is normal? And I again get that 'deer in the headlights' look. I don't think most Docs get it. But one time I decided to actually measure my output for the Doc. So I go over to LabCorp to get the gallon plastic container and come home. I was supposed to measure my output for 3 days to get a good average. When I showed back up at LabCorp, the gal asked me why I was back. I said.........because the first one is filled....and if you want 3 days worth you better give me 5 or 6 more of those containers. I ended up not doing it, as a few times I had to empty my bag when I didn't have one of those gallon containers handy, so that test was blown. But I explained it to my Doc and she understood. The short gut world is a rather special place all to its own.

Although I originally criticized the small size of the Sensura Mio bag.........I've come to actually like it. The reason being I can now wear almost all my old t-shirts that weren't long enough to cover my Hollister bag. I'm mindful of the smaller size and constantly check it, but haven't even come close to overfilling. And their bigger bag is just plain HUGE and I'd feel like a circus clown wearing that thing around all day. I've even gotten used to the silly Velcro wing closure. It's not ideal, takes a bit more time than the Hollister clips, but is worth the effort to me to have a shorter bag. The Sensura belt is unsupportive, as you mention, but I haven't had a leak, or even close to a leak since switching over. And it's a better fitting and smoother feeling material than the Hollister belt. I may try the Nu-Hope belt, as you suggest. I like their products, but haven't found anything I can specifically use......but they are a neat company.

No, will never give up.......sort of can't, if you know what I mean. I also think my skin irritation is reducing with the Coloplast stuff, so I'm going to stick with it for now. And I think their sealing ring is more flexible than the Hollister ring to boot! All win-win for now. Thanks for your post............good info!!

Regards,

Bob

I have been using the same Colo Flip for a long time. I had tried Hollister also. On the Colo Flip bag, there is a way to cut out the filters, even a YouTube video on how to do it. Colo makes a bag without the filter, but it is transparent. The best part of the Colo Flip for me is the bag comes off easier with less of a mess, and I can attach a new one just as easily. I need to take some heavy meds, especially at night (look at my pic and you will see why), and that's when I am most active. So sometimes it's easier for me to swap the bag and leave the flange. I changed the flange today. I got a full week out of it, but I am not working or doing anything that would cause any sweat or such. I am lucky to get out of bed and walk to the bathroom. I also use the Nu-Hope belt for support but mostly a Stealth Belt with a stoma cap or a small piece of foam. I hope you get the kinks out and your skin heals up. Have you tried a different "skin barrier product"? I switched when I had skin issues, and my skin healed up right away.